I would love to see more formulators on here…
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It’s really unfortunate that you see it that way. Your trying to “boil it down” and this just isn’t one of those things. No one is making excuses. The standardization version is pricey, we already have a ton of pricey ingredients in the product. We decided to not put it into the formula because we are very happy with it as it is. I think you are mistaking what we do as a brand /company. And maybe our future content w/ people such as PP can shine a better light onto who we are and what we do. We aren’t like the majority of brands out there, we have a full scale manufacturing facility. We make our own products in-house. If we want to make a product in the future based on feed-back we can and we will. In this case we made something we liked and enjoyed and found great productivity out of. I’m not sure what more you want? No one is trying to cover up or convince you of anything nefarious here. Like it or don’t. I don’t care. This is why we refer to consumers as goons. It’s a precarious relationship when dealing with “experts” and casual supp users.
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Is the bacopa an extract, or just bacopa powder? Is there 100mg caffeine in Hybrid, or NMT 25mg? I’ve heard both now from people claiming to be associated with Glaxon.
You’ve made your points and explanation clear about why you chose to not use a standardized extract. You can say I misunderstand or mistake what you’re doing, and you can not care, that’s your right, of course. And I do appreciate you taking the time to explain your reasoning and decisions, since you didn’t have to.
People reading this can decide if they agree with the decision and if they think the product is worth trying.
That said, I’d really like an answer on the caffeine content in Hybrid. NMT 25mg or 100mg? That’s a pretty substantial difference.
I mean, if it’s something made for you and your employees, and you don’t care if customers like it, why are you getting so defensive with me?
Even pointing out that my post is why you call the people who pay you “goons,” it’s not helping the PR tbh.
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You mean “goons”
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He’s right though, anyone who would buy those overpriced supps is a goon
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Looks like they’re a lot cheaper on some other sites, or at least one other site, than on their own site, which is very typical, but Adrinall is still over $2 per serving, which is pretty pricey, although nootropics in general tend to be bizarrely expensive as a whole.
One more thing. Seeing as you use lion’s mane in your nootropic, would you mind giving your input on how you picked your extract/dose/etc? Mycelium vs fruiting body? Hericenones vs Erinacines? Polysaccharides and beta-glucan standardization?
There’s a good discussion here, and I’m sure you have an interesting take on it and how you arrived at the extract/dose/etc. you used:
It’s an old post/article, but the thread has recently been updated with more information on studies, as well as some conversation with Host Defense, who are pretty knowledgeable about mushrooms.
Sinfit is updating the texture and taste on their cookies to start 2020
macros:
310 Calories
12g Fat
20g Protein
35g carbs
I can arrange this.
We could set up reddit-style AMA’s regularly with formulators.
Was planning on doing this with @Joey_Savage on IG live instead but to have it archived is cool
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I appreciate that @Extrabeef and here is my motivation.
I/we have all tried supplements that look great on paper. The issue is that, well, as Chris Berman would say ‘that’s why they play the game’. On paper does not translate to working well together in a formula. I’ve tried supps (as stated earlier) that had ‘the right ingredients’ but just did nothing. I’ve tried others (Ghost Legend comes to mind) that just works for me. If you look at it, you may say ‘light’ in some areas, but it just works.
I’d love to hear from the formulators who look at ingredients panel and opine that ‘nope wouldn’t put those together’ etc…
You bring up an important point here.
2 ingredients at ‘less than clinical’ doses CAN be more powerful than one at the clinical dose. generalizing hard here for simplicity, but brands like Ghost are awesome because on paper their pre looks light, but it’s actually quite effective for most consumers.
I used to be a lot like @muscleupcrohn always wanting the EXACT clinical dosing, and complaining all over the internet when something missed it. I seriously traveled far and wide teaching people how to read supp fact panels, all about ingredients and dosages, what to look for in products. I’ve spoken in front of a few hundred GNC RSDs literally explaining to them how to interpret their own products. The two things I’ve come to realize speaking with real industry professionals in research and formulation is the point above ^^ as well as the fact that these companies do not owe the consumer explanations just as the consumer doesn’t owe them a purchase.
Man, if everyone was required to stick to the exact dose in your favorite pubmed article we’d have a total of 14 pre workout formulas with a bunch of different labels.
for the record- I still love NutraBio PRE in its clinical holy-ness and still use it frequently. But sometimes it’s ok to step outside that comfort zone and trust a formulator who might know what he’s doing.
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And let’s face it - at the end of the day - what is the goal here? To be able to supplement an overall performance enhancement strategy. I want to ‘look better’, ‘feel better’, ‘prepare for competition/NFL Combine/Power lifting competition’…If said supplement enables that to happen then outstanding. If an athlete used Ghost Legend while preparing for the NFL combine and he gets drafted - the goal is reached. For some to argue, ‘bro it only contains 4G of L-Citruline’ is well…you get it.
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I mean, at the end of the day most people just want some pump and energy in the gym.
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now send me that PB &J whey bby…
To be honest, I had to settle on this one which is 30% polysaccharides from the actual fruiting body. (Now, polysaccharides is a broad term that does include all major carbohydrate chains in fungi including chitin, glycogen, but most predominantly beta-glucans) Considering our deadlines going to market and the various extracts that are available, I like you trying to be a purist, had some difficulty in finding an appropriate ethanolic or if possible some sort of other fat-soluble extract that’s more in-line with the research that’s been done. So far, I haven’t found this “remarkable” lion’s mane, but I don’t mind hunting down unicorns (I’ve got a list). I love Paul Stamets and take his Agarikon daily - just because. Perhaps what I find most compelling about Lions Mane is that it isn’t specific to the CNS, but also promotes nerve growth in the periphery. I think this could even possibly end up creating a newer category of a “physiological nootropic” that instead of acting centrally, works more on neuromuscular communication and efficiency.
This probably isn’t as interesting of a story as you’d hoped for, but I have plenty of good stories about other ingredients.
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Exactly. If you could give me energy/pumps/focus with about 300MG of caffeine or less and I’m in.
One other thought here. I recall a quote from Jim Stoppani (waits for boo’ing and hissing from the Forum to simmer down)…perhaps not a quote, but a comment when he was discussing PreJym…it’s about the ‘nutrients to fuel your workout’. That resonated with me. NutraBio Pre does an excellent job of that of course as do others…
Simply a random thought
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