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Primforce Dendrobium. Ive seen it in various preworkouts. Is it worth using as a standalone or adding to a preworkout??


From what I remember, DS said it was a crazy new stim and claimed it was in their Craze and that Dendro is what gave it that meth-like feel.

… after Craze got caught with meth(not real meth but you get the idea), dendro fell off the earth. I only know of Primaforce now who sells it


That was actually not dendrobium. It was the “coverup” for what the compound really was, that being N,alpha-Diethylphenylethylamine

Actual dendrobium is not that remarkable as an ingredient.


As I recall, DS listed on the label that the dendrobium was standardized for PEA and a few related alkaloids, but there’s no research showing it contains any of those. I guess it’s possible they discovered some cool new extract, but it’s also possible it had a synthetic amphetamine alkaloid. Fun stuff.


I finally know what they put in there. I knew there was no dendro in there, but was never certain about the stim they spiked it with


Those spotted cats…


How do you know what was in there? Are you able to disclose?


I imagine because it was in a Gaspari product, too.


It was n,alpha-diethylphenylethylamine
Also referred to as an ETH-amphetamine, the reason it’s called ETH, is because it’s only a few changes away from being actual METH.

It was tested all around the world by independent labs and confirmed to have it. Marc Lobliner also sent out a tub from his own inventory to be tested, it came out positive, hence he stopped selling all DS products.

The reason why detonate had the ingredient in it is because Gaspari was licensing/getting the same dendrobium “extract” from Matt Cahill (the owner of driven sports)

Matt Cahill has a very bad history. Sold DNP in his fat burners, etc (DNP can kill you from the inside out)

Adding all of this together, and seeing that there is no reason for independent labs all around the world to falsify information, it all makes sense

Talk about having no ETHical standards


Yeah I’d heard he rumors of what it contained but I never looked into the lab tests. Craze was already gone by the time I actually read about that stuff, so I wasn’t too concerned and didn’t dig too deep. I had heard about Gaspari using the stuff from DS. Funny story, I actually worked at GNC at the time, and for about a week, I had people coming in daily like “do you guys have Craze?” “Sorry, no, we took it off the shelves.” “Do you have Detonate?” “Sorry, no, we never carried that.” “Okay thanks.” The first few times, I couldn’t figure out why they only wanted those two products. Didn’t make sense until I read a little bit. It’s so sad how people find out something was spiked with a scheduled drug, and they go searching for it. That said, I do kind of wish I had bought up all the stock at my local stores before they pulled it so I could sell it on the side. I could have made a killing.


My final for my Public Speaking class was based on spiked supplements in the supplement industry. Had several slides focused solely on Cahill. He really is a scumbag the more you look into him. DNP, Superdrol, ETH…


the fact that he’s not only allowed to sell supplements, but the fact that people still BUY them is totally nuts to me


Long story short on Craze - it had a meth analogue:

This was some craziness in the BBcom forums. After Jack3d got removed from the market, this stuff came out, and anyone who’d ever taken an amphetamine knew that something was up. The testing began from other interested parties, and the exact compound seemed to have been concealed pretty well - the stuff had the same molecular weight as one of the PEAs they were claiming was in there, or something like that.

But nobody could find any substantiation that dendrobium makes any PEA at all, which was a canary in the coal mine. Eventually it was determined with accuracy what was really in there, and it sure as shit wasn’t from dendrobium.

How Cahill is not behind bars was once beyond me, but nothing surprises me anymore after the last couple of decades Americans have had to deal with. He must have made some kind of “deal”.

As for dendrobium itself… it might provide a dash of feel-good-ness but nothing insane.


They dropped the case without reason at some point. Which makes me suspicion. I really think the industry needs to self regulate and black list companies better.


I always found it astonishing how a couple people over on SR would post stuff like “The original Craze was so great, really miss it”, knowing that it was spiked. It actually pissed me off quite a bit, because they were praising a product that made the industry look bad.


if there’s anything we’ve learned from the 2008 crash or from the tech boom, it’s that industries don’t really self-regulate the way they should in theory.


I still dream about those spotted cats…


“usp labs have been busting nuts on my face for years, not anymore. I’m a craze whore now!”


Lmaoooo I remember returning back to fitness after 5 years and seeing that video, as well as all the reviews on forums. Craze pretty much being my first pwo (after 5 yrs off gym), I just thought this was what preworkouts were like


nope just meth